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Topic: Rear wheel noise

in Forum: C3 Handling Components

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Rear wheel noise (1/33)
12/11/07 2:49pm

shanes79
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Tacoma, WA - USA

Vette(s):
1979 L48 Resto-Mod. ZZ383 w/ TKO-500 manual transmission. Centerforce clutch. Tail light conversion. A/C. BeCool radiator. Red exterior with custom black and white leather interior by Mid America Motorworks.

Joined: 10/30/2007
Posts: 85

I was taking the Vette out for a weekend drive and noticed a problem.
After about 2 hours of driving, the rear driver side wheel started to make a "grinding/squeeking" noise. I brought her home and let it sit for a few hours, took it back out to analyze the problem...and it had gotten better. Instead of squeeking/grinding all the time, it only happens when you get on the throttle. This varies between acceleration rates (ie. it will grind at slow acceleration one time, and only at fast acceleration other times). Any ideas??

No vibrations noticed. No difference in the handling. I've cleaned the brake rotors and calipers...still making noise. I know that my parking brake needs adjustment (it doesn't stop the car from rolling forward, and barely stops it from rolling backward). I'm stumped.

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Rear wheel noise (2/33)
12/11/07 4:09pm

wetvet
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Lake Oswego, OR - USA

Vette(s):
1972 Steel Cities Gray T Top. Original Owner, Original Paint and Interior. The running gear has been rebuilt. only 250,000 miles on the clock..

Joined: 10/17/2003
Posts: 558

You should check out your rear wheel bearings. Jack up each side and check to see if there is lateral movement of that wheel.

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Rear wheel noise (3/33)
12/11/07 4:44pm

checked that. I jacked up each side, grabbed the tire at the top/bottom and left/right sides...very little to no movement. I am going to try and adjust the parking brake to see if that helps. any gotcha's with that??

Rear wheel noise (4/33)
12/11/07 5:30pm

VetteCountry

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Belvidere, IL - USA

Vette(s):
1977 Black T-Top ZZ4 5Sp 16in Wheels

Joined: 10/24/2004
Posts: 438

Sounds like a U-Joint going out.

Rear wheel noise (5/33)
12/11/07 10:02pm

Adams' Apple

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Duncanville, TX - USA

Vette(s):
#1-1974 L-48 4spd Cp Med Red Metallic/Black deluxe int w/AC/tilt/tele./p/w-p/b/ Am-Fm/map light National/Regional/Chapter NCRS "Top Flight" #2-1985 Bright Red/Carmine Cp.L-98/auto Member: NCRS, NCRS Texas, Corvette Legends of Texas

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A "grinding/skweeking" noise in the rear is usually a wheel bearing, whether there is play in them or not.

Of course, it can also be the park brake, so check all of the easy stuff first.

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Rear wheel noise (6/33)
12/12/07 6:29am

Okay. So here is what I've got... I'm going to appologize for the long post, but I want to be as detailed as possible in the hopes that someone who is more mechanically inclined/experienced can help me out...

I adjusted the parking brake at the hub and the equalizer spring per the haines manual. The parking brake on the driver side is the one giving me trouble. When i test drove the car last night, no problems. Today on the way to work, the driver side parking brake seemed to engage and started squeeking. I know its the parking brake due to the fact that you can change the pitch of the squeeking by actuating the the parking brake...and also by the burning brake smell Wink

Here is the other issue I'm having. I'm thinking that this problem is definitely a wheel bearing...but just for the sake of getting opinions, I'll describe what I've got....

When starting from a stand still, there is a clunk on the same wheel..varries between one solid clunk and a few smaller ones...but it is very pronounced, audible, and you can feel it in your seat when it happens. What do ya'll think?

Rear wheel noise (7/33)
12/12/07 6:56am

78SEvette

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Holland, OH - USA

Vette(s):
1978 Silver Anniversary Edition

Joined: 11/29/2004
Posts: 217

Usually a wheelbearing will make noises all the time. It will change according to speed. I loud clunck seems to me like a uni joint - maybe. With the car on the ground and in gear, crawl underneath and try to rotate the half-shafts with your hands back and forth. If the uni's are tight, there should be little or no movement. If the movement seems to be more than you think it should be, I'd have them checked out further. Have you tried to feel the hub after driving for awhile? if the wheel bearing is bad or going bad, there will be an excess amount of heat right at the spindle area.

Rear wheel noise (8/33)
12/12/07 7:47am

[QUOTE=78SEvette] Usually a wheelbearing will make noises all the time. It will change according to speed. I loud clunck seems to me like a uni joint - maybe. With the car on the ground and in gear, crawl underneath and try to rotate the half-shafts with your hands back and forth. If the uni's are tight, there should be little or no movement. If the movement seems to be more than you think it should be, I'd have them checked out further. Have you tried to feel the hub after driving for awhile? if the wheel bearing is bad or going bad, there will be an excess amount of heat right at the spindle area.[/QUOTE]

I'm gonna take the car to the auto hobby shop on base during my lunch break and adjust the parking brake. I'll check the Ujoints while I'm under there.

Rear wheel noise (9/33)
12/12/07 11:14am

Adams' Apple

The trailing arm bushings could also cause a clunk on take-off, as could the front diff cushions.
You'll prolly find a bad u-joint, regardless!

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Rear wheel noise (10/33)
12/12/07 3:26pm

Took the car to the hobby shop at lunchtime. This is what I've found. 1. The parking brake cable on the driver side hub is disconnected. For now i have zip-tied it to the rear control arm. 2. The U-joints are in excellent shape. No movement at all. 3. The wheel bearings are all good.

I honestly think that my problem lies within the hub under the rotors where the parking brake components are at. Here's my question. Can you take the caliper off without disconnecting the lines? And second....WHAT THE HECK WAS CHEVY THINKING WHEN THEY RIVETED THE ROTORS TO THE HUB???!!!! Wits%20End

Anyway..any tricks to drilling those darn things out?? Should I be cautious of anything or just have at it??

Rear wheel noise (11/33)
12/12/07 3:45pm

Here is what I'm working with....

Rear wheel noise (12/33)
12/12/07 6:06pm

Whats a good drill bit size to use while drilling out those rivets?
Sorry for all the questions...but ya know what they say "to be old and wise you must first be young and stupid."

I'm in the "young and stupid" phase. Wink

Rear wheel noise (13/33)
12/12/07 6:08pm

You can not remove the caliper without disconnecting the line the brake line. To drill out the revets: First remove the caliper and plug the brake line so fluid doesn't flood everything. Then put the lug nuts on the to hold the rotor in place. Next use a center punch to mark the center of the revet, then use a 1/8 drill, drill in about 3/8" deep, then step up to a 3/8" drill to remove the revet cap. The revet looks like a "T". You need to drill off the top of the "T". Good Luck.

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Rear wheel noise (14/33)
12/12/07 6:18pm

WETVET...thanks for the response. I'll take the advise on the drilling. Doesn't look like too hard of a job...but any job involving drilling anything makes me a little weary. I got the caliper off...capped off the brake line with one of the many bolts from my "spare parts" collection Rolling%20On%20The%20Floor%20Laughing

I'll start the drilling when I find the time this weekend. Hopefully all goes well.

Rear wheel noise (15/33)
12/12/07 9:05pm

LuvMyGezrToy
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Fallon, NV - USA

Vette(s):
1978 Coupe, Red w/black leather interior, L48, Auto, A/C, Power Windows, Cruise, Tilt/Tele.

Joined: 7/25/2007
Posts: 43

Shane,

I had a problem a while back that I swore was an E brake problem for some of the same reasons you state but turned out not to be. I offer this link https://www.c3vr.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=70528 as something to check out since some of what you write reminds me of the problem I experienced. This may be way out in left field from what you have going on but thought I'd offer it up since you haven't pinned down the cause yet and some of what you say reminds me of my toys problem.

Worst case, you read it and delete it. Best case, you have the same thing happening that I had and can easily fix it.

Just thought I'd throw it out there for consideration. Good luck Shane.

Ernie

Rear wheel noise (16/33)
12/13/07 4:29am

Ernie: Thanks for the info. Since the car is up on jack-stands I will go ahead and change the diff. fluid and add only 1 bottle of additive. Can't hurt right?
Im swamped with work and school papers, but hopefully I will get to it this weekend. Big%20smile

Rear wheel noise (17/33)
12/13/07 5:11am

jbs82vette
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Mint Hill, NC - USA

Vette(s):
1982 White Corvette, dark blue leather interior, 70,000 miles

Joined: 10/25/2007
Posts: 123

Here's a good article

http://www.corvettemagazine.com/2005/july/brake/brake-lead.asp

Rear wheel noise (18/33)
12/13/07 7:37am

cilrah

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Port Orchard, WA - USA

Vette(s):
1978 Indy Pace Car 4851 of 6502, Auto, L-48

Joined: 6/20/2005
Posts: 4066

Shane, I think Ernie might be right, that sounds alittle like the problems both he and I had and can be an easy fix by replacing the fluid (and limited slip additive) in your rear end. What you describe sounds a lot like the symptoms I had, especially being able to feel the grinding and almost a popping under your seat. Give it a try, can't hurt Thumbs%20Up

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Rear wheel noise (19/33)
12/13/07 5:59pm

79rebuild
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Yelm, WA - USA

Vette(s):
1979 L82 4 speed Scat 383 crank 190 cc Procomp Aluminum Heads 202 160 stainless valves GM Powder metal rods Speedpro H860CP Hypereutectic pistons 280 cam hydralic HEI Pro comp 1.6 roller rockers Mighty Demon 750 Sanderson CC1AP Hedders.

Joined: 7/12/2007
Posts: 356

[QUOTE=shanes79]Ernie: Thanks for the info. Since the car is up on jack-stands I will go ahead and change the diff. fluid and add only 1 bottle of additive. Can't hurt right?
Im swamped with work and school papers, but hopefully I will get to it this weekend. Big%20smile

[/QUOTE]

My vette shop recomended I use two of the little GM bottles in mine. Maybe they just wanted to move their inventory though Wink

I can tell you this sounds just like mine before I stopped driving it andI tore it all down. It would make a horrible grinding-scraping sound when making slow tight right hand turns but only after it had warmed up. It was a real oh si*t what was that noise. I really hope the additive fixes yours cause if it's the same sound mine had I know it's pretty horroble!

Rear wheel noise (20/33)
12/15/07 7:03pm

So here is where I'm at. I managed to remove the caliper without disconnecting the brake line. Its suspended by a handy-dandy wire coat hanger and is out of the way. I've drilled out the rivets per instructions from WETVET. darned rotor still wont come off!! Any tricks to getting this baby off? Here's what I've got so far:

Rear wheel noise (21/33)
12/15/07 7:41pm

Adams' Apple

Knock the rivets on thru the hub. They're gonna be tight, but they should come out, at least some of the way. They don't have to come all the way, but just enough to get them out of the rotor.
Then, spray around the center of the hub, where the rotor sits, with WD40, or something similar. With a medium sized mallet/hammer, tap all around the edge of the rotor, just outboard of where the studs are(where your white mark is in the pic), to break the rotor loose from the hub.
You may also need to loosen the parking brake adjustment, if there is a ridge on the backside of the rotor where the p-brake goes. Use the holes in the front of the rotor to get to the adjusters, at the bottom of the assy. With a screwdriver, you can turn the adjusters one way, and loosen the brake, the other way tightens it.
Have patience...it will come off.

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Rear wheel noise (22/33)
12/16/07 7:25am

[QUOTE=Adams' Apple]Knock the rivets on thru the hub. They're gonna be tight, but they should come out, at least some of the way. They don't have to come all the way, but just enough to get them out of the rotor.
Then, spray around the center of the hub, where the rotor sits, with WD40, or something similar. With a medium sized mallet/hammer, tap all around the edge of the rotor, just outboard of where the studs are(where your white mark is in the pic), to break the rotor loose from the hub.
You may also need to loosen the parking brake adjustment, if there is a ridge on the backside of the rotor where the p-brake goes. Use the holes in the front of the rotor to get to the adjusters, at the bottom of the assy. With a screwdriver, you can turn the adjusters one way, and loosen the brake, the other way tightens it.
Have patience...it will come off.

[/QUOTE]

When you say "on thru the hub" do you mean knock them into the hub itself? The idea I'm getting from your post is to take a phillips screwdriver and with a hammer pound them into the hub...then remove the pieces once i get the rotor off. Is that what you mean?

Rear wheel noise (23/33)
12/16/07 9:42am

Take a drift punch to knock them in.( a phillips screwdriver will make a mark and mushroom the end and will keep the rivets in that hole of the hub. All the rivet pins need to clear in the thickness of the flange of the rotor. The pieces will fall out after you get the rotor off. Wd40 around the center of the hub/rotor connection is a good idea. Also tap all the way around the rotor with a (rubber) dead blow hammer. Also make sure your e-brake shoe is backed off, that will keep the rotor sticking on that assembly. Another idea(hint) is make sure you can rotate the rotor/spindle/driveshaft to get to that hole to adjust the e-brake and tap on the rotor all the way around that hub/flange.
WETVET2007-12-16 09:46:03

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Rear wheel noise (24/33)
12/16/07 10:22am

Adams' Apple

Yeah...what HE(Steve) said...

A drift punch is gonna be the best. A screwdriver prolly ain't gonna be stout enough to do it.
If the rivets don't seem to want to budge, you may wind up drilling a little deeper into them, to get the rotor released. When the rivets are installed originally, they are pressed with a hydraulic press, which swedges the whole rivet, as well as flattens the ends. So, the part of the rivet inside the hole on the hub is also tight. It takes some serious persuasion to get them out, sometimes.

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Rear wheel noise (25/33)
12/17/07 9:35pm

PHEW! And I'm spent!!
Finally got the rotor off. First thing I noticed was that the top "shoe return spring" was broken and was rolling around inside the rotor. Also, the front shoe was cracked in 3 spots. That may explain some of the noise I've been hearing. I've got the old parts removed...and MOST of the new parts installed (got a parking brake restoration kit). I've installed the new shoes, springs (top and bottom), and adjuster. But I am having a hell of a time getting the rear hold back spring and cup installed onto the trapped pin. Wits%20End

I spent 3 hours on it tonight, cut the hell outta my hand and decided to call it a night. I know that the article Jon posted (jbs82vette) said there was no trick to installing those darned things (and the Haynes manual is even more worthless than Michael Moore)....but does anyone here have any tips for me??? If you've done this job before and got those things on, what tools did you use??

I'm just tired of this job!! doh

I'm about at the point where I want to just weld the parking brake cable to the control arm and only rely on the parking brake on the passenger side. just remove the driver's side all together!! Tongue

It's definitely "beer-o-clock" at my house right now!

Rear wheel noise (26/33)
12/17/07 10:18pm

Adams' Apple

I know whut ya mean aboot the one pin...PITA!!

Try this....pull it all the way thru as far as you can, then put some sillycone on it where it goes thru the backing plate, and let it sit.

I've heard of other ways to do it, but I cain't think of them rite now...

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Rear wheel noise (27/33)
12/18/07 4:07pm

Instead of doing my desk-job today at work, I wasted ya'lls well earned tax dollars doing some research on the internet. There was a "how to" post made on a random site that mentioned compressing the springs and tying them off with dental floss until after they were installed on the pins. THEN, cut or burn the floss to release the springs. I'm gonna go give that a shot. I'll let you know how it works out.

Rear wheel noise (28/33)
12/18/07 6:29pm

So ummm..that didn't work either. What's everyone's take on cutting the flange plate and making the access hole larger? I was thinking of making it a rectangle shape to allow enough room to do the job from the front? I doubt that this would cause a ballance issue due to it being so close to the center of rotation. What do ya think??

Rear wheel noise (29/33)
12/21/07 3:32pm

jimiam
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Memphis, TN - USA

Vette(s):
1981 Red 1993 Black Rose

Joined: 2/16/2007
Posts: 134

I don't think I would enlarge the hole. Not because of a balance or any weakness issues, but simply because it isn't factory. (which could mean something to you or someone else in the future) Just my two pennies.

Chances are high that if you keep this car long, you'll be going back through all this again for wheel bearings at some point. Give it a little longer, you'll get it I'm sure. Nice looking car by the way. Smile

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Rear wheel noise (30/33)
12/21/07 8:12pm

Sounds like it's rough going. You probably don't want to hear this but when I took my TA in to be rebuilt they were both pretty much shot e-brakes included. It was about 350 an arm to be copletely rebuilt. Might be something to think about. I like being able to DIY but that was one area of the car I was more than happy to hand off to someone way more smarter than me.

Rear wheel noise (31/33)
12/21/07 8:36pm

Adams' Apple

Uh...you talking about cutting the hub itself???
If so, then NO, that ain't so good an ideer. Not safe at all, no matter where or how large a hole you enlarge.

I have heard of using string/floss to compress the springs, but, Imma thinking it would have to be some pretty dang stout floss to do that!

I must be weird(don't say it, Tux!), but I don't think I've ever really had that hard of a time installing that spring...it is a pain, I'll give ya that, but a little patience goes a long way!

Here's another idee you might try...
Instead of trying to hold the spring(s) compressed with the dental floss, make a slip-knot with a length of it. Take the open end of the "noose", and slip it over the pin head, and snug the knot up good and tight. Then, run the other end of the string/floss thru the center of the spring cup/retainer. Now, you have something to hold the pin out with while you install the spring/retainer. You can even tie it to something, so you have both hands to work with. This is a trick I've heard of for years now, but while I've never actually done it meself, I hear it works well.

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Rear wheel noise (32/33)
12/23/07 2:25am

CeeDee
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New Zealand

Vette(s):
Silver '81 mostly original C3. Silver interior, bilstiens, big sway bars, headers.

Joined: 3/26/2005
Posts: 232

Yup been here, done that, here's a post I put up on C3VR
a while ago about how to sort that pin. Works a treat. As I
say on the post, I have pix of the whole thing I can email
to you if you give me your email address.

Cheers
Kiwi Chris

https://www.c3vr.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=61700&KW=

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Kiwi Chris

Rear wheel noise (33/33)
12/23/07 7:47pm

Finally Done!! Joel and Chris Thumbs%20Up

Got the new parts installed and the parking brake works great! Still making a grinding noise when you really get on the throttle...so hopefully replacing the diff. fluid fixes that.

Thanks to Joel and Chris. Both of your posts helped me out quite a bit. If anyone has to try this project in the future, the magic tool that does wonders is FISHERMANS FORCEPS!!!

I grabbed 2 at Dick's Sporting Goods...($5.00 ea). Using Joel and Chris's Ideas combined with those two wonder tools, I had the job done in 2 hours. (both front and rear shoes)

Thanks once again for everyone's help. Merry Christmas.

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